制造杀人犯（2015）

Making a Murderer S01E10

Part 2 Sept. 1, 2020, 10:32 a.m.

我知道我儿子是清白的
And I know my son is innocent.
布兰登·戴西已经十九岁了
Brendan Dassey is now 19 years old
目前正在波蒂奇的哥伦比亚监狱
and spending the last part of his teenage years
度过他最后的少年时光
at Columbia Correctional Facility in Portage.
戴西的新律师说他应重新接受审判
Dassey's new attorneys say he should have a new trial.
陪审团并未听取足够多的证据
The jury did not hear a lot of evidence
戴西要求重新审判
电♥话♥连线
史蒂夫·德利岑
戴西的律师
这些证据本可以向他们解释
which would've explained to them
为何布兰登会承认并未犯下的罪行
why Brendan confessed to a crime that he did not commit.
伊利诺伊州芝加哥
西北大学法学院
我从一开始就听说了这件案子
I had heard about this case from the get-go.
当史蒂文·埃弗里被逮捕
When Steven Avery was arrested
纽♥约♥时♥报♥
并因特瑞莎·海尔贝克被杀害遭到起诉时
and charged with Teresa Halbach's murder,
那在当时也算是轰动一时的大新闻了
that was big news in the innocence world.
DNA证其清白
再次被指控新罪名
当布兰登被逮捕的时候
When Brendan was arrested,
我立刻注意到了这个案子
that was immediately on my radar screen
因为此案是威斯康星州最早实行
because it was one of the first video-recorded interrogations
史蒂文·德利岑
布兰登的裁后律师
青少年冤假错案中心联合创始人
录影审讯的案件之一
in the State of Wisconsin,
我还曾参与了那起
and I had been involved in the litigation
使最高法♥院♥要求录影审讯的诉讼案
that led the Supreme Court to require videotaping.
史蒂夫·德利岑一生致力于研究虚假供认
Steve Drizin has made his life work studying false confessions...
青少年冤假错案中心
我很高兴能有一个拥有丰富资源
so I was very pleased that somebody with the resources,
经验以及良好口碑的人
the experience and the credibility,
罗伯特·德弗拉克
布兰登的裁后律师
尤其是能接手这个案子的招供方面的问题
especially on confession issues, took over the case.
这意义重大
That was huge.
在那时我便有意参与此案
It was at that point I was willing to step in,
来观摩他们的工作
um, just to watch them work.
看他们各显神通并成为其中的一员
See them do what they do and to be a part of that.
我们在裁后动议中提出要争辩的是
What we argue in our post-conviction motion
布兰登的预审律师莱恩·卡钦斯基
is that Brendan's pre-trial attorney, Len Kachinsky,
违反了忠于布兰登的义务
violated his duty of loyalty to Brendan.
劳拉·尼莱德
布兰登的裁后律师
青少年冤假错案中心
全美的每名律师
Every attorney in this country
都应对当事人尽到忠诚义务
owes a duty of loyalty to their clients.
这是宪法赋予律师的权利之一
That's part of the constitutional right to counsel.
而在此案中卡钦斯基律师运用手段
And what happened in this case is that Attorney Kachinsky
实质上是胁迫了布兰登认罪
took steps to essentially coerce Brendan into pleading guilty.
我们争辩
And we argued that
卡钦斯基律师的行为是绝对无法容忍♥的
Attorney Kachinsky's behavior is absolutely intolerable,
威斯康星州的任何法庭都不应允许此种行为
that no court in Wisconsin should sanction that kind of conduct
而布兰登应重新接受审判
and that Brendan should get a new trial.
2010年1月15日
布兰登的裁后动议聆讯首日
杰罗姆·福克斯法官
马尼托沃克县巡回法♥院♥
你是在3月7日还是3月8日被指派的
You were appointed, was it on March 7th or March 8th?
-3月7日 -3月7日好的
- March 7th. - March 7th. OK.
你3月7日那天有和布兰登谈过话吗
Did you talk to Brendan on that day, on March 7th?
莱恩·卡钦斯基
布兰登的预审律师
-我觉得没有 -好
- I don't believe I did. - OK.
不过你有和媒体谈话是吗
However, you did talk to the press, is that right?
是的在我被指派之后没过多久
Yes, shortly after the appointment,
办公室的电♥话♥响个不停
the calls started rolling into the office.
好
Sure.
现在你注意听下26台的一段新闻报道
I want to draw your attention to a news report from Channel 26
芭芭·塔迪克
布兰登的母亲
其中提到 "我们16岁的当事人
that says, "We have a 16-year-old who,
在道德上和法律上都无法开脱
while morally and legally responsible,
他很大程度上是受到了一位可以称之为
was heavily influenced by someone that can only be described
混世魔王的人的影响" 对吗
as something close to evil incarnate." Right?
那上面说是我说的但我没这么说
That's what it says I said, but that wasn't me.
好
OK. Um...
这份陈词中是否有哪里让你觉得不舒服
Is there anything about this statement that bothers you?
要是说"我们16岁的当事人
To say that we have a 16-year-old
在道德上和法律上都无法开脱"
who's morally and legally responsible,
实际上等于认罪
that would in effect admit guilt
这种话是绝对不该说的
and that is something you should definitely not say.
为准确起见法官大人
Just for the record, Your Honor,
卡钦斯基先生在证人席上表示他没说那些话
Mr. Kachinsky testified that he did not make those comments
接下来的这件证物将作为反驳证据
and this exhibit is being introduced as impeachment evidence
证实卡钦斯基事实上说过那些话
to demonstrate that in fact Mr. Kachinsky made those comments.
法庭接受这份证物
The court will receive it.
戴西案庭审
2010年1月20日 0:01:38
莱恩·卡钦斯基律师立即抨击了史蒂文·埃弗里
Attorney Len Kachinsky immediately lashed out at Steven Avery.
电♥话♥连线
莱恩·卡钦斯基
我们16岁的当事人
We have a 16-year-old who,
在道德上和法律上都无法开脱
while morally and legally responsible,
他很大程度上是受到了一位可以称之为
was heavily influenced by someone that can only be described
混世魔王的人的影响
as something close to evil incarnate.
次日你发表声明称
And, uh, the next day, you make the statement
"如果该供词有效并被采纳为证据的话
that "If the confession is valid and admissible as evidence,
此案基本上就会以罪名成立告终"
it would almost certainly result in a conviction."
-对吗 -是的
- Right? - Correct.
好你当时还未查看布兰登的证词对吗
OK. You still hadn't reviewed Brendan's statement, right?
是的没错
No. That's correct.
-第一份证词 -是的
- That first statement? - Correct.
好 3月10日那天
All right. March 10th appears to be
似乎是你第一次去看他对吗
the first time you went to see him, is that--?
-应该是的 -好
-That sounds correct. - OK.
而等你们见面结束之后
And when you got out from that meeting,
记者和媒体在等着你对吗
the press was there waiting for you, right?
-我到的时候他们就等着了 -好
- They were there waiting when I got there. - OK.
-对没错 -好
- Yes, they were. - All right.
我想让你谈谈接受NBC26台采访的事
I want you to refer to an interview with you from NBC 26.
采访中说到 "卡钦斯基表示此刻
It says that, "Kachinsky says at this point
他并不排除会在此案中协商认罪协议" 对吗
he hasn't ruled out negotiating a plea deal in the case." Right?
-没错 -好
- That's correct. - OK.
那对布兰登的案子有什么推动作用呢
And how did that advance Brendan's case?
因为我知道布兰登的家人也看新闻
Because I knew that Brendan's family was watching these newscasts
所以实际上我想通过传递这一消息
and so in effect it was a message to try
让他们慢慢接受
to get them accustomed to the idea
布兰登可能得采取他们不喜欢的法律方案
that Brendan might take a legal option that they don't like,
因此目标观众有一部分是布兰登·戴西的家人
so part of the intended audience was Brendan Dassey's family.
-是 -也有布兰登自己
- Yeah-- - And Brendan himself.
而他与外界唯一的接触
About his only contact with the outside world was, uh,
-就是见他的父母和看电视 -好....
- visits with his parents and, uh, television. - Yeah. Now...
对布兰登最有利的办法就是
Brendan's best interest was
去证明他是有自己的道德标准的
to demonstrate that he had his own moral compass.
莱恩·卡钦斯基
布兰登的预审律师
并且他并不理所当然得就是埃弗里家的傀儡
And he wasn't necessarily the pawn of the Avery family,
因此在任何情况下
that he could make his own moral decisions
他都可以根据自己的道德标准判断对错
as to what was right or wrong under all the circumstances,
而在特瑞莎·海尔贝克被杀一案中
and part of that would be to admit being involved, you know,
他也能按自己的标准行事
in the death of Teresa Halbach.
那天和布兰登见面过程中
During that meeting with Brendan on that day,
他告诉你不是他做的对吗
uh, he told you he didn't do this. Correct?
我想他说过
I believe he did.
他还告诉你他所说的
And he told you that what he said
以及起诉中所谓的出自他口的供词
and what was in the complaint about what he said
都不是真的对吗
was not true. Correct?
-我想他说过 -好
- I believe he said that. - OK.
当时他还告诉你
And he also told you at that time
他想做一次测谎
that he wanted to take a polygraph test
-以证明没说谎对吗 -对
- to prove that, correct? - Oh, correct. Yes.
好布兰登一直声称自己是清白的
OK. So Brendan is asserting his innocence.
-对 -和你谈话的时候
- Yes. - When he talks to you.