制造杀人犯（2015）

Making a Murderer S01E05

Part 5 Sept. 1, 2020, 10:30 a.m.

你说你是11月3号♥打的电♥话♥
And you said that you called that on the 3rd of November?
是的
That's correct.
海尔贝克先生你有没有删除任何信息
Mr. Halbach, did you erase any of the messages?
没有
I don't believe I erased any messages.
好的谢谢
All right. Thank you.
克拉兹先生你可以传唤你的下一位证人了
Mr. Kratz, you may call your next witness.
谢谢法官大人
Thank you, Judge.
我需要现场连线法官大人我们要打给一位先生
Via telephone, Your Honor, we're gonna be calling a gentleman
他叫托尼·齐默曼
by the name of Tony Zimmerman.
齐默曼先生请问您是做什么工作的
Mr. Zimmerman, how is that you're employed?
我是一名网络工程师就职于辛格勒无线公♥司♥
I am a network engineer with Cingular Wireless.
361号♥证物
用户活动记录
辛格勒无线公♥司♥
作为一名网络工程师是否有人找过你
Now as a network engineer, have you been asked to review reports
要求查看一位名叫特瑞莎·海尔贝克的女士的
that deal with the wireless usage
无线网络使用报告情况
of a young woman by the name of Teresa Halbach?
是的我查看过
Yes, I have been.
在2005年10月31日下午2点41分之后
After October 31st, 2005, 2:41 p.m.,
辛格勒西棕榈滩分公♥司♥
海尔贝克小姐的账户有没有活动
was there any activity in Ms. Halbach's account after that time?
手♥机♥没有手♥机♥方面没有活动
Not from the mobile itself. No, there was no activity.
接下来看一下372号♥证物
Turning to exhibit number 372 for a moment,
接收日期 2005年11月2日
你觉得这个情况会不会让用户的
do you have an opinion about whether or not this would fill up
语♥音♥信箱爆满
the capacity of this subscriber's voice mailbox?
这个情况看起来好像不会
This appears that it would not have filled up
让语♥音♥信箱爆满
the full capacity of the mailbox.
好的
All right.
那么如果有人在11月3号♥
And so if one was getting a message on November 3rd,
呼叫这个号♥码时得到了"语♥音♥信箱已满"的回复
when calling this particular phone number that said "Mailbox full,"
那是不是就说明
would that indicate to you that
有些信息已经被删除了
some messages had been erased that
没有出现在372号♥证物上
are not reflected on this exhibit number 372?
如果11月3号♥有人听到了提示
If somebody heard that recording
说信箱已满
that the mailbox was full on November 3rd,
那么在这一证物中最新的留言被收到前
then at least one or more messages had to have been removed
至少有一条或以上的留言已经被删除了
before the new message at the top of this document was received.
新留言接收时间2005年11月16日
如果在某个时候
If at some point
有人打电♥话♥过来发现她的语♥音♥信箱满了
people were calling and finding her mailbox was full,
然后信箱里之前有的一些信息没有了
then some of the messages that were on that mailbox are gone.
它们被删掉了为什么
They were erased. Now why?
为什么有人要删掉一个失踪的
Why would you erase the messages of a woman who is missing
后来被证实被杀的女人的留言...
and later then found to have been killed, um...
尤其是当这些留言有可能
when those messages might
与她的行踪有关比如她去过哪儿
have clues to her whereabouts, to where she went,
或是她准备去哪儿
where she was going, perhaps.
她的弟弟作证说他确实在周四下午
Her brother testified that he did listen on Thursday afternoon,
或是在有人报♥警♥的时候听过部分留言
or right when the police were called, to some of the messages.
他也确实知道她的密♥码♥
He did have her password,
但他否认删除过留言
but he denied erasing any of them.
那么如果不是他删的又是谁干的呢
Well, if he didn't erase them, then who did?
大约在她失踪的三周前
About three weeks before she disappeared,
汤姆·皮亚斯
特瑞莎的同事
特瑞莎·海尔贝克
Teresa Halbach, you were aware
一直有很多电♥话♥打进来
had been getting a lot of telephone calls
但她都没有在手♥机♥上接听吗
that she was not answering on the cell phone?
是的有天她就站在我旁边
Yes, sir. She was standing almost right next to me in a day
然后有电♥话♥进来她看了一眼就说
and she got this phone call and she looked at it and went--
"别又是他们"还是"别又是他"之类的
Oh, she made-- "Oh, not them again" or "Not him again" or whatever.
然后就没再提过但她有点...
And just kind of forgot about it. And she was--
看起来有点不高兴
She looked a little upset
我就问她是怎么回事
so I questioned her a little bit about this
她就跟我说别管了
and she just told me "Just forget about it"
只是有人一直给她打电♥话♥什么的
and that somebody keeps calling at all different hours and blah, blah.
只是骚扰电♥话♥而已
Just a nuisance call. Um...
那大概是两到三周前吧
And that was about two to three weeks--
她也说这种事已经有一阵子了
And she had mentioned that she had been getting them for a while.
我就说"你要不把电♥话♥号♥码给我
And I said, "Well, why don't you give me the number
我打过去看看
and I'll call and find out,
能不能让他别再打了"
and, you know, intervene a little bit."
但她说 "不必了不用担心"
And she said, "No, don't worry about it."
而且她不管手♥机♥上显示的来电是什么
And she rec-- Whatever the number was that came up on her phone,
她都知道是谁打的吗
she recognized it?
是的她都知道只是她不愿意告诉我
Yeah, she knew what it was, but she wouldn't let me know.
谢谢
Thank you.
劳拉·沙德里亚
辛格勒无线公♥司♥的经理
所以如果你们的记录显示
So if your records show that,
在某个特定的日期特瑞莎·海尔贝克手♥机♥上
on a certain date, messages were opened
在这个日期前的所有留言都被打开了
all the way up to that date on Teresa Halbach's phone,
这就表示有人听取过这些留言
that would mean that somebody had listened to those voice messages.
我想请求陪审团离场
I'd like to be heard outside the presence of the jury.
克拉兹先生
Mr. Kratz?
他将要给她看一些在11月2号♥打开的语♥音♥留言
He's about to show her some retrieved voicemails on the 2nd.
如果布汀先生的立场与辩方的理论
If Mr. Buting's position, if his theory as the defense
是特瑞莎·海尔贝克在11月2号♥还活着
is that Teresa Halbach is alive on the 2nd of November,
我们有权利知道
we're entitled to know that.
我们有被告知的权利
We're entitled to notice of that.
我反对这与本案无关
That's my objection, is that it's irrelevant.
克拉兹先生可能会推论
Mr. Kratz may draw the conclusion that
留言在11月2日被打开
because messages are opened as of November 2nd,
就表示我认为当日特瑞莎·海尔贝克仍然活着
that means that Teresa Halbach was alive on that date.
不是的
I don't.
我也不认为陪审团需要作此推测
And I don't think the jury needs to either.
但是我想提交一些记录
But I do intend to introduce records
可以表明她的语♥音♥信箱
that show that her voicemail was picked up
在11月2日早上8点被接通
at 8:00 a.m. on November 2nd.
在这个对本案非常关键的时段里
Something was going on with this phone
也就是在10月31日至11月5日期间
in a very, very critical period of time for this trial,
也就是她的车被发现那天
which is between October 31st and November 5th,
或者11月3日她被报告失踪那天
when her car was found,
这部手♥机♥发生了些什么
or November 3rd when she's reported missing.
这个讯息何以有助于陪审团判断凶手是谁
How does that help this jury decide who killed her?
这正是陪审团在此的目的法官大人
That's what the jury's here to do, Judge.
因为除非公诉方要证明
Because unless the State's prepared to establish
埃弗里先生知道她的密♥码♥
that Mr. Avery had her password,
那么他就并非11月2日当天8点
then he's not the one who's listening to her messages
听取她的语♥音♥讯息的人
on Wednesday, November 2nd at 8:00 a.m.
然而他们的理论是
So that-- And their theory
他已经销毁了手♥机♥
is that he's already destroyed the phone.
-我并未这么说...-是一个认识她的人
- I never said-- - Somebody who knew her,
一个拥有埃弗里先生并没有的动机的人
somebody who may have had a motive that he doesn't have
一个有机会的人听取了她的留言
and somebody who may have had opportunity was doing that.
-我并非暗示她当时仍活着 -听起来像第三...
- I'm not suggesting she was still alive. - Sounds like a third--
第三方责任法官大人他们意图提出第三方责任
third-party liability, Judge. That's what it sounds like.
我不...
I don't, um...
我不是要向陪审团主张这一点
I'm not gonna argue that part to the jury
因为法庭并不允许
because that's what the court says we're not gonna do.
但就相关性而言
But as far as what's relevant is,
警方已经有这份报告
the police have had this report
但并未跟进查明情况
and the police have not followed up to find out what's up here.
公诉方知道是谁听取了语♥音♥信箱吗
Does the State know who accessed the voicemail?
我想我们...
I suppose we--
如果我们事先得知布汀先生要暗示
If there was an inkling that Mr. Buting was going to suggest
海尔贝克女士当时还活着的可能性
that Ms. Halbach was alive at that time,
我们会提前对此进行调查的
this is something that could've been looked into investigatively.
如果辩方要改变他们的理论法官
It's another thing that we could do, Judge,
我们也会去追查此事
if the defense is changing its theories.
这完全不是改变理论
This is not changing the theory at all.
这完美地显示出
This fits perfectly to show
他们并没有追查这条线索
that they have not followed up this investigative lead
因为这线索指向了埃弗里以外的人
because this investigative lead points elsewhere than Mr. Avery.