制造杀人犯（2015）

Making a Murderer S01E03

Part 8 Sept. 1, 2020, 10:29 a.m.

我们真心希望你这次能如实交代好吗
We really need you to be honest this time with everything, OK?
如果你确实做了某些
If in fact you did some things
我们认为可能发生了
which we believe some things may have happened
可你本不想告诉我们的事没关系
that you didn't want to tell us about, it's OK.
只要你能如实交代都没关系的
As long as you can-- as long as you be honest with us, it's OK.
你要是撒谎那可就麻烦了好吗
If you lie about it, that's gonna be problems, OK?
这样可以吗好
Does that sound fair? All right.
那两名警探
The two detectives developed
给他灌输了这种诚实的观念
this theme of honesty and they repeatedly,
在审问时也重复了几十次他们告诉布兰登
dozens of times in that interview, they say to Brendan,
"如实交代好吗你知道诚实很重要"
"Now be honest, OK? You know how important it is to be honest."
劳伦斯·怀特教授
迪恩和杰瑞的供词专家
可当看到录像带的时候
But when you watch the videotapes,
我认为很明显
it's clear to me, I think,
当他们对布兰登说"如实交代"时
that when they say to Brendan, "Be honest,"
他们其实想说的是
what they sort of mean is...
"别告诉我们那个而是要说别的"
"Don't tell us that, tell us something else."
说一些符合他们的犯罪理论的话
Something that fits their theory of the crime.
我认为你到他家去
I think you went over to his house,
可能是想给他送信
maybe you asked him to get his mail,
这里漏掉了些事情
something in here is missing.
当我拿到信的时候
Well, when I got the mail,
有一个信封上写着他的名字
there was like an envelope in there with his name on it.
-好 -好这就对了
- All right. - OK. Now we're going.
你做了什么
What did you do?
我敲了门他开门了
I knocked on the door and he answered it.
-好然后呢 -我把信给了他就走了
- Yeah, and then what? - I gave it to him and then got lost.
听我说你听到那里有人尖叫
Come on now. You just heard screaming over there.
别为难我们也别为难自己
Stop making this hard on us and yourself.
如实交代你进屋了是不是
Be honest. You went inside, didn't you?
-是 -你进拖车了吗
- Yeah. - You went in the trailer?
你在点头
You're nodding.
我认为此案的警探们并没意识到
I think the detectives in this case were unaware
他们对布兰登供词的影响程度
that the degree to which they were shaping Brendan's statements.
这也是为什么
That's why it's very important
查看审讯录像至关重要
to take a look at the record of the interrogation
以便弄清谁先提到了具体的情况
to see who mentions particular facts first.
那些话是不是布兰登
Do they come from Brendan
在没有警♥察♥提示的情况下说出的
without any help from the police
还是先从警♥察♥嘴里说出的
or do they in fact come first from the police?
很明显在这次审讯中有好几次
And there are several occasions in these interrogations
都是警♥察♥们先提到关键信息
where apparently crucial bits of information
而不是布兰登·戴西提到的
are mentioned first by the police and not by Brendan Dassey.
他们真正做错的地方
Where they really messed up
就是他们在试图获得那一个真♥相♥时
was when they tried to get the one fact,
就是那一个绝密的
the one absolutely secret
至今未对外公布的实情
fact that nobody in the public yet knew,
也就是特瑞莎·海尔贝克是怎么死的
was how Teresa Halbach died.
没人知道他们有证据表明
Nobody knew that they had evidence
她死于头部中枪
that she had been shot in the head.
他们要是能让布兰登说出死因
If they could get Brendan to say that,
那就非同凡响了
then that would be dynamite,
因为没人知道死因而如果他说了出来
because no one knew that and here if he came out and said it,
那就肯定是真的了
then it must be the truth.
所以他们才会不断问他 "说吧布兰登
And so they kept asking him, "Come on, Brendan.
她身上还发生了什么
Something else happened to her now.
我们知道她身上还发生了别的事"
We know something else happened to her."
最后说得越来越具体
And eventually they got more specific.
"她身上还发生了什么
"What else happened to her?
她的头怎么了布兰登告诉我们"
Something happened to her head, Brendan, tell us."
在他说了"我们刺伤了她"之后又问
This is after he says, "Well, we stabbed her."
"好那她身上还发生了什么
"Well, yeah, but what else happened to her?
她的头怎么了" 提示又提示
Something happened to her head." Hint, hint.
说吧
Come on.
她的头怎么了
Something with the head.
布兰登
Brendan?
你们还干了什么说吧
What else did you guys do? Come on.
他逼你做了什么布兰登
What he made you do, Brendan.
我们知道他逼你做了其他的事
We know he made you do something else.
是什么
What was it?
是什么
What was it?
我们有证据布兰登
We have the evidence, Brendan.
我们只需要你...
We just need you to...
老实交代
to be honest with us.
-他把她头发剪了 -他剪了她的头发
- That he cut off her hair. - He cut off her hair?
好还有呢
OK. What else?
他还对她的头做了什么
What else was done to her head?
他用拳头打了她
That he punched her.
还有什么
What else?
你看看他就会发现他就那样坐在那里
When you look at him, he's just sort of sitting there
很长时间一动不动
with these long pauses and he--
你好像都可以看见
You can almost see, you know,
他脑子里的齿轮在缓慢地转动
the wheels in his head turning however slowly,
他在想"他们想让我说什么"
saying, "What do they want from me?"
他一直在猜答案
And he's guessing.
没关系的他逼你做了什么
It's OK. What did he make you do?
-用刀割她 -割她的哪个部位
- Cut her. - Cut her where?
-割她的喉咙 -你割了她的喉咙
- On her throat. - You cut her throat?
在她身上还发生了什么她的头怎么了
What else happens to her? In her head?
要让我们相信你你讲的这些至关重要
Extremely important you tell us this... for us to believe you.
说吧布兰登还有什么
Come on, Brendan. What else?
我们已经知道了我们只需要你亲口告诉我们
We know. We just need you to tell us.
我能记住的就是这些了
That's all I can remember.
好吧那我就要直接问了
All right, I'm just gonna come out and ask you.
是谁朝她的头开的枪
Who shot her in the head?
-是他 -你之前怎么不告诉我们
- He did. - Why didn't you tell us that?
因为我想不起来
'Cause I couldn't think of it.
现在你想起来了吧
Now you remember it?
跟我们说说是怎么回事
Tell us about that then.
我认为是维格特变得不耐烦然后说出
I think Wiegert is the one who actually got frustrated and said,
"好吧那我就要直接问了
"All right, I'm just gonna come out and say it.
是谁朝她的头开的枪"
Who shot her in the head?"
他自然会回答"是他" 但这时
And of course the answer is "He did". But by then,
他把一条本可以用来证实
he's blown the one piece of secret evidence
布兰登的说辞的秘密证据亲口告诉了他
that could've corroborated Brendan Dassey's story
从而使证据失去了应有的效力
by feeding it to him himself.
布兰登你需要上厕所什么的吗你确定吗
Hey, Brendan, you need to use the bathroom or anything? You sure?
需要别的什么吗
You need anything else?
需要吃三明治还是什么吗你有拿到汽水吗
Sandwich or anything? Did you get your soda?
-是的 -我们大约两分钟后就会回来好吗
- Yeah. - OK, we'll be in in about two minutes, OK?
-我有个问题 -说吧
- I got a question, though. - Sure.
这个审问还要进行多久
How long is this gonna take?
要不了多久就结束了
It shouldn't take a whole lot longer.
你觉得我能在1点29分之前赶回去吗
You think I can get there before 1:29?
应该不能
Probably not.
1点29分有什么事吗
What's at 1:29?
我第六节课有份作业要交
Well, I have a project due in 6th hour.
我们之后再想作业的事好吗
OK. We'll worry about that later, OK? All right.
-我几分钟后就会回来 -好的
- I'll be back in a few minutes, OK? - OK.
另一件让人困扰的事情是
Another troubling aspect
布兰登并没有真正地认识到
was the fact that Brendan didn't really understand
他的处境岌岌可危
the precariousness of his own position.
他并不知道
He has no understanding
从那以后他就不会从少管所里出来了
that he's not going to be released from custody at this point.
他刚刚承认犯下了非常严重的罪行
He has just admitted to really awful crimes.
很显然我们是警♥察♥ 对吧
You know, obviously, that we're police officers, OK?
基于你刚才跟我们说的话
And because of what you told us...
我们将要对你实施逮捕
we're gonna have to arrest you.
你之前预料到这样的事会发生了吗
Did you kind of figure that... was coming?
因为你的所作所为我们现在没法放你走
For what you did, we can't let you go right now.