转折点：原子弹与冷战（2024）

Turning Point: The Bomb and the Cold War S01E02

Part 2 March 18, 2024, 3:47 p.m.

but they had grain.
问题在于他们试图解决农业部门
The problem was that they were trying to deal with
效率极低的问题
an extremely inefficient agricultural sector,
也无法生产出足够的粮食
and they couldn't produce grain enough.
集体化无法养活整个国家
Collectivization couldn't feed the country.
这个疯狂的经济实验基本上就是造成饥荒的主要原因
This crazy economic experiment created, basically, a famine.
大范围的饥荒物资短缺
Mass starvation, shortage of goods,
食物严重短缺
a shortage of food on a grandiose scale.
集体化的结果是
As a result of collectivization,
苏联各地普遍面临饥荒
there was general starvation and general food shortages
和粮食短缺
all across the Soviet Union.
1932年和1933年的冬天
In the winter of 1932 and '33,
斯大林决定利用这次饥荒让情况变得更加严峻
Stalin decided to take advantage of that famine and to make it harsher,
使得饥荒在苏联疆域的乌克兰进一步肆虐
and make it even more lethal in Ukraine, which was a part of the Soviet Union.
（乌克兰）
斯大林从统治伊始
Stalin, from the very beginning of his rule,
就特别忌惮乌克兰人
particularly feared the Ukrainians.
俄♥国♥革命期间乌克兰人
The Ukrainians had tried to organize their own state
曾试图建立自己的国家
at the time of the Russian Revolution.
他们与布尔什维克进行了激烈的斗争
They fought bitterly against the Bolsheviks.
乌克兰发起了一项特殊的粮食收集计划
A special program of food collection was instigated in Ukraine.
人们挨家挨户抢走农民的粮食
People went house to house taking away the food from peasants.
有时候乌克兰警♥察♥甚至会闯进民宅
Sometimes police forces in Ukraine would go into somebody's house
连烤箱里的食物都不肯放过人们三餐不济食不果腹
and take food out of the oven so people would have nothing to eat.
1932年冬天乌克兰边境被封锁
In the winter of 1932, the borders of Ukraine were sealed.
人们无法离开共和国
People were unable to leave the Republic.
也无法前往其他地方获取食物
And they were unable to travel and get food anywhere else.
其结果就是人们不得不吃老鼠
The result of it was that people ate rats, and they ate mice,
还试图把树叶和草皮煮熟了吃
and they tried to boil leaves and grass.
人吃人的情况也时有发生
There were incidents of cannibalism as well.
在接下来的几个月里这一政策
The result of that policy over the next several months
导致乌克兰近400万人死亡
was that some nearly four million people died in Ukraine.
这就是现在人们所熟知的乌克兰大饥荒
It's what's now known as the Holodomor.
这全部是斯大林所为
And that's all Stalin.
20世纪30年代末
In the late '30s,
苏联成为了真正的极权主义国家
the Soviet Union becomes truly totalitarian.
克里姆林宫控制所有的选举而结果总是一样的
The Kremlin runs all elections, and the outcome is always the same.
所有异议都会被封♥杀♥
All dissent is stamped out.
（列昂尼德 ·拉姆津被指控密谋政♥变♥）
根据《苏联刑法典》
Leonid Konstantinovich Ramzin,
第58条第三款、第四款、第六款和第十一款列昂尼德 ·拉姆津
according to Articles 58-3, 58-4, 58-6, and 58-11 of the RSFSR Criminal Code,
将被处以极刑
is sentences to the highest degree of social protection
枪决并没收全部财产
by shooting execution with confiscation of all property.
该判决为终审判决不得上诉
The verdict is final and cannot be appealed.
1937年和1938年是所谓的大恐怖时期
1937 and '38 was the time of the so-called Great Terror.
斯大林很多疑
Stalin was paranoid.
十分担心他身边的人其实是他的暗敌想要杀死他
Concerned those around him were actually his secret enemies and wanted to kill him.
那些从一开始就与斯大林一起参与斗争反对帝俄的布尔什维克
Those Bolsheviks with whom Stalin began his struggle against Imperial Russia,
几乎尽数被清洗
nearly all of them were exterminated.
这个国家陷入了自我毁灭的狂欢之中
The country plunged into an orgy of self-extermination.
苏联建立了一个庞大的集中营系统
The Soviet Union constructs a huge system of concentration camps,
被称为古♥拉♥格♥
known as the gulag.
数以百万计的人们被送到了那里
To which millions and millions of people are sent.
古♥拉♥格♥是一个庞大的劳♥改♥营系统在其鼎盛时期
The gulag was a vast system of labor camps that, at its height,
几乎遍及苏联的
stretched all the way across the Soviet Union
每一个角落
in almost every part of the country.
斯大林试图消除危险
Stalin is trying to remove danger.
消除那些有可能挑战他地位的人
People that can challenge him potentially,
有能力组织抵抗运动的人
that have intellectual capacity of organizing some sort of resistance.
工程师、教师、学者
Engineers, teachers, academics.
古♥拉♥格♥的存在既是为了惩罚人们也是为了恐吓人们
It was designed both to punish people and to frighten people.
但建立古♥拉♥格♥也是为了使用奴隶劳动
But it was also created in order to use slave labor,
本质上还是为了建设苏联经济
in essence, to build the Soviet economy.
这些名字代表了共♥产♥主义罪行的受害者
These names represent the victims of communist crimes.
代表了在苏联占领爱沙尼亚期间被驱逐至西伯利亚还有被杀害的人们
People who were deported to Siberia or killed during the occupation regimes.
所以你可以在这里看到成千上万的名字
So, there you can see thousands and thousands of them.
大约有1500万到2000万人
Something like between 15 and 20 million people
在不同时期被送进了集中营
went through the camps at some point.
数百万人死在了那里
And several million people died there.
纳粹的罪行在全世界受到广泛谴责
The Nazi crimes were widely condemned across the world.
而苏联的罪行却从未被关注
But the Soviet crimes never were.
斯大林自20世纪20年代末创建的体制
The mechanism Stalin created from the late 1920s,
以及他所杀害的人数
and the number of people he killed,
所产生的影响其持久性
had an impact that turned out to be so much more lasting
远远超出了任何人的想象
than anybody could imagine.
假如把苏联比作地球
If you imagine the Earth,
斯大林不仅杀死了树叶
Stalin didn't just kill the leaves,
杀死了花朵杀死了树木
or the flowers, or the trees,
片甲不留
or the first layer of Earth.
他还要掘地三尺
He went really deep down.
他还要斩草除根赶尽杀绝
He ripped out the roots. A lot of them.
我不认为有哪个俄♥罗♥斯♥统治者曾像斯大林那样对自己的人♥民♥
I don't think that any Russian ruler was as genocidal towards his own people
实施种族灭绝
as Stalin had been.
他所到之处尽为焦土
He really went into the soil.
他的所作所为极其恶毒
And then poured incredibly poisonous stuff,
他的遗毒影响深远
really toxic material, into the soil
以确保他的余孽...
to make sure that whatever he produced
还会继续在世界上横行肆虐
would be different from what it was before.
（1945年）
第二次世界大战结束后杜鲁门总统想知道
After World War II, President Truman wanted to know,
"斯大林到底想要什么? "
"What does Stalin want?"
美国人的目光越过柏林的内部边界
The Americans looked across the internal borders of Berlin.
他们向东看去
They looked east.
看到的是约瑟夫·斯大林的军队
What they saw was Joseph Stalin's army,
正打算从德国攫取一切
intending to take what they could
所能攫取的战利品
as spoils from Germany,
也许还打算继续向西进军
and perhaps intending to keep marching west.
苏联军队从东德偷走了一切能偷走的东西
The Soviet army stole everything they could from Eastern Germany,
包括火车、煤炭和小麦
up to and including trains, coal, wheat.
偷走了一个国家赖以生存的所有东西
Anything that could ensure the survival of a nation.
就这么偷走了
Just took it.
西方世界正在试图重建地方政♥府♥
The West is trying to re-establish local governments,
重建国家政♥府♥ 启用货币
re-establish a national government, introduce a currency,
重建民♥主♥
re-establish democracy.
斯大林却说我失去了差不多2000万国民
Stalin says, you know, I didn't just lose 20 million or so of my citizens
为的可不是放弃控制权
to give up control.
此外还有其他各种各样的问题
There's all kinds of other issues.
苏联士兵所犯下的强♥奸♥罪行数量惊人令人触目惊心
Soviet soldiers tragically had carried out massive numbers of rapes,
并造成了严重的健康问题导致了怀孕
and you had health consequences and pregnancies,
斯大林却矢口否认
and Stalin was just denying that happened.
1945年战争结束后
In 1945, after the war,
苏联军队进驻波罗的海沿岸国家
you have Soviet troops in the Baltic states.
苏联军队进驻波兰、捷克斯洛伐克、匈牙利
You have Soviet troops in Poland, in Czechoslovakia, in Hungary,
罗马尼亚和保加利亚
in Romania, Bulgaria.
这些从未选择成为共♥产♥主义国家的国家都被迫
All these countries that never chose to be communist are made, forcibly,
成为了共♥产♥主义国家
to be communist.
在西方主流言论中战争结束于1945年
In the Western mainstream discourse, 1945 is the end of the war.
但是在这里在世界的这个角落 1945年并非任何终点
But over here, in this part of the world, 1945 is not the end of anything.
战争并没有换来和平与常态
And it's not replacement of war with peace and normality.
而是新来的侵略者取代了原本的侵略者
It's the replacement of one occupation with another,
一种极权主义制度替换另一种极权主义制度
and one totalitarian system with another.
斯大林到底想要什么?
So, what does Stalin want?
他的目标是占领整个东欧吗?
Does he aim to take all of Eastern Europe?
他会就此罢手吗?
Will he stop there?
美国政♥府♥中有且只有一个人
There was one person in the government of the United States,
可以为杜鲁门总统解答这个疑问
and really only one, who could tell President Truman that.
这个人就是乔治·凯南
That was a man named George Kennan.
1946年初乔治·凯南担任美国
In early 1946, George Kennan was the Chargé D'affaires
驻莫斯科大使♥馆♥临时代♥办♥
in the American Embassy in Moscow.
也就是说他是二号♥人物
What that means is he was the number-two guy,
负责掌控大局
and he was running the show.
1946年冬乔治·凯南
George Kennan, in the winter of 1946,