人工智能的真相（2023）（3）

To help us understand why we often feel so conflicted
人类往往感到矛盾
when we interact with AI,
有请来自伦敦国王学院的凯特·德福林博士
please welcome from King's College London, Dr Kate Devlin.
凯特 欢迎来到讲座 你也看到观众的回答了
Kate, welcome to the lectures. Now, you saw the audience respond.
他们真的不想让我打它
They really didn't want me to whack it.
让我们来问问一些观众
And let's actually ask some members. Ok.
你们想让我打它吗 你们想让我打它吗
Did you guys want me to whack it? Did you want me to whack it?
不想 为什么你不想让我打点点
No. Why didn't you want me to whack Spot?
我就是...不想让你打它 因为
II just didn't... I just didn't want you to whack him because, like....
我也不清楚为什么 -好吧 有点道理
I'm just not sure why. - OK, fair enough.
这边 有谁想回答吗
Over this side, who wants to answer? Ok.
为什么你不想让我打点点
Why didn't you want me to whack Spot?
抱歉 它很贵
I did... Oh, sorry. It's very expensive.
它很贵
Very expensive!
你都不敢相信它有多贵
You wouldn't believe how expensive, actually.
还有别的答案吗 -因为它很重要
OK, and one other answer? - Because it's, like, really important.
人们花了很大努力才能做出它
It, like, took a lot of hard work to make that.
所以打它是错的
So it's kind of just, like, wrong. Ok.
这些其实都是很好的答案
These are all pretty good answers, actually.
花了很大努力才创造出它
It took a lot of work to make it, and
而且它确实很贵
it's frankly quite expensive.
那么凯特 你觉得为什么我们的观众
So, Kate, why do you think our audience felt so different
会对打它有如此不同的感觉
about whacking the...
他们一致同意打面包机
They were all up for whacking the toaster.
丽芙打得可上瘾了
And Liv, we had to pull her off!
那为什么他们的感受会如此不同
So why did they feel so different about that?
肯定有一个因素是因为它很贵 没错
There's definitely an element of, you know, it's expensive, yes.
但还有 点点有一些像动物
But, also, Spot is a bit like an animal.
它是个动物形机器人 所以它像动物
It's a zoomorphic robot, so it resembles an animal
它动起来也像个动物
and moves around like an animal.
那为什么会觉得打机器狗这件事奇怪呢
OK, so why is it odd to think about whacking a robot dog?
场外的米凯尔可开心了 我看得出来
Mikhail's having a lot of fun out there, I can see!
这里有很多因素在起作用
There's a number of different things at play.
有可能是因为我们觉得打点点
So it could be that we think that maybe hitting Spot
会导致它的痛苦
would cause pain.
尽管我们知道点点无法感知痛苦
Even though we know that Spot can't feel pain,
点点没有任何的感受
Spot's not got any feelings.
也有可能是因为点点有一些吓人
It could also be that Spot is a little bit scary.
在某种程度上表现得像个捕食者
Acts a bit like a predator in some way.
所以我们的大脑的一部分会想
So part of our brain is thinking,
不要攻击点点 因为点点可能反过来攻击我们
"Don't attack Spot, because Spot could attack us back."
所以也有这点
So there's that as well.
但另外也有可能是因为
But also there may be an element that we don't want to be seen
我们不想被认为是伤害或者损坏了点点的人
as the person who has hurt Spot or damaged Spot in some way.
所以也有一些观念的因素
So there's sort of judgment as well.
有一些社会判断的因素在这里
A bit of social judgment coming in there, too. Ok.
你觉得这对我们人类来说意味着什么
What do you think that says about us as human beings?
我们是通过社交来理解这个世界的
We make sense of the world through being social creatures.
所以当我们看见带有相似社会性的机器人时
And so when we see robots that have some semblance
我们想和它们以同样的方式相处
of sociality, we want to engage with them in the same way.
凯特 谢谢你加入我们
Kate, thank you so much for joining us
解释这些问题
and going through those issues.
也再次谢谢点点
And thanks again to Spot!
所以对于我们很多人来说
So for many of us,
有一种把点点这样的机器人
there's a compulsion to treat a robot like Spot
当作活物的冲动
as if it were a living thing.
或许我们对待人工智能的方式
And maybe the way that we treat artificial intelligence
更多地解释了我们人类 而非人工智能
says less about AI and more about us as human beings.
这就引出了人工智能领域
And this takes us to one of
最激烈争论的问题之一
the most hotly-contested issues in AI.
显然 机器在变得更聪明
Clearly, machines are getting smarter.
我们在之前两场讲座中已经见识过了
We've seen that in the last few lectures.
它们正以惊人的速度变得更加聪明
They're getting smarter at a really remarkable rate.
但人工智能有可能
But could AI at one point
在未来的某个时间觉醒意识吗
in the future ever be conscious?
有意识的机器会和我们一样吗
And would conscious machines be the same as us?
我们都有意识 而且我们都知道我们有意识
Now, consciousness, beyond the fact that we all have it,
但除此之外 意识
and we all know that we have it,
是一个意外地非常难以描述的概念
is really quite surprisingly tricky to pin down.
它实际上是科学和哲学界最大的问题之一
It's actually one of the biggest problems in science and philosophy.
最大的问题是
And the big problem is this.
我们知道脑子里的一些电化学反应
We know that certain electrochemical processes in the brain
会产生意识
give rise to consciousness.
我们在第一个讲座里看到了这些电化学反应
We saw those electrochemical processes in the first lecture.
它们是怎么产生意识的 为什么会产生意识
How do they do that and why?
我们不知道
We don't know.
坦白说 科学界也没有达成共识
And, honestly, there isn't really any agreement.
那么关于意识我们能说什么呢
So what can we say about consciousness?
大部分专家同意
Well, most experts agree
意识的一个关键的因素
that the ability to experience things
是你能从自身的角度出发
from your own personal perspective
感受事物
is a key ingredient.
比如像幸福 痛苦 快乐 沮丧之类的经历
Experiences like joy, pain, happiness, frustration.
所以我们来做个实验
So we're going to do an experiment to try to understand
理解这个想法如何解释人工智能
what that idea says about AI.
让我们来欢迎一些来宾 一些动物来宾
And we're going to welcome some guests, some animal guests.
我们的第一个嘉宾 请轻轻鼓掌欢迎它
And our first guest, please welcome with some quiet clapping,
因为它们有点紧张 狗狗豆豆
cos they're a little bit nervous, Dido the dog.
你好豆豆 你好
Hello, Dido! Hello.
豆豆的生活是什么样的呢
Hello! Now, what would it be like to be Dido?
到处走走 闻闻东西
Walking around, smelling, sniffing things.
你能想象豆豆的精神生活吗
Can you imagine Dido's mental life?
你觉得她会兴奋吗
Do you think she gets excited? Yeah?
你认为她会期待一些事情吗
Do you think she anticipates things?
我想任何养狗的人都知道他们真的可以
I think anybody who owns a dog knows that they really do.
谢谢你豆豆
OK. Thank you, Dido.
我们的下一个嘉宾是老鼠木木
Our next guest is Woody the rat.
欢迎你木木
Welcome, Woody.
同样的问题
So the same question.
木木有生活阅历可言吗
Does Woody have experiences?
你能想象木木的生活是什么样的吗
Can you imagine what it would be like to be Woody,
到处跑动 闻东西 吃东西
running around, smelling things, eating things?
但我想我们也可以同意 木木的生活阅历
Yeah? But I think we can also agree that the range of experiences
不会像豆豆那样广泛
that Woody has is a lot less than Dido does.
同意吗 谢谢你木木
Agreed? OK. Thank you, Woody.
有请杰西
Welcome, Jesse.
狼蛛杰西又怎么样呢
What about Jesse the tarantula?
你觉得它会兴奋吗 会有所期待吗
Do you think it gets excited? Do you think it anticipates things?
这很难知道
It's difficult to know.
谁认为
OK, who thinks that Jesse
狼蛛杰西有丰富的精神生活
the tarantula has a rich mental life?
还是有相当一部分人同意
OK, there's a fair number of you do.
我必须告诉你们 专家们还没有定论
Well, I have to tell you, I think the jury is out on this.
我们还不知道 显然这还不确定
We don't really know, obviously, it isn't clear.
最后
OK, and finally,
我们最喜欢的机器狗点点呢
what about our favourite robot dog, Spot?
来吧点点
Come on, Spot.
在学习了人工智能的相关知识后
Now, after all you've learned about artificial intelligence,
你们觉得点点有感受吗
do you think Spot has experiences?
没有 我觉得点点根本没有感受
No. I don't think Spot has experiences at all.
我们能想象动物感受世界
We can imagine our animals experiencing the world,
但机器 就不太行
but machines, not so much.
就因为这个原因 我觉得人工智能程序
And for that reason alone, I don't think that AI programmes
目前还没有意识
right now are conscious.
我认为目前机器还没有意识 有一部分原因
And I think part of the reason that it's impossible for machines
是意识存在于我们的身体之中
right now to have consciousness is that we exist in bodies.
我们通过身体感受这个世界
And through our bodies we experience the world.
或许我们得给人工智能
So maybe we need to give AI a body,
一副像人类一样的躯体
like a human body,
里面装有像人体那样的感受器
that's equipped with sensors like a human body,
感受器的种类要比点点体内的丰富得多