原初真相：迈克尔杰克逊1993年案件最新证据浮现（2019）

I came to New York to attend NYU to study music business.
我到纽约大学学习音乐商务
Yeah, I was 16 years old, um I- I turned 17 shortly thereafter,
是的 我当时16岁 不久之后就满17了
but when I arrived in August of 2001, I was 16 years old.
2001年8月当我来到这里时 我还是16岁
Of course, 9/11 happened just- I believe my second week of classes?
当时可以说是混乱的 我正在上第二周的课程时
So that colors the memories, um, of that time,
911事件就发生了
but it was- it was overwhelming in general.
所以我那段时间的记忆很鲜活
I mean- I was on my own. Um, I-
总的来说是让人不知所措的
I went to go see Michael Jackson on September 10th,
我全凭自己 一人在9月10日去看了迈克尔杰克逊的演唱会
and I was starting classes.
同时开始上课
I was responsible for getting myself to classes every single day.
我每天都要让自己坚持去上课
It- it was definitely overwhelming, you know?
你知道这真的很难
I came to New York University to study music business, and part of the reason
我到纽约大学学习音乐一部分原因是
that I was so interested in music business was because, um,
我对音乐业很感兴趣
I'd been such a big fan of Michael Jackson,
我是迈克尔·杰克逊的超级粉丝
not only of his music and his dance and all that,
我不仅崇尚他的音乐他的舞蹈
which is incredible, but also of his business acumen
和一切不可思议的东西 而且还有他的商业头脑
so I came to NYU knowing so much about publishing,
所以我来到纽约大学了解了很多
and royalty rates, and things like that because
所以我来到纽约大学了解了很多关于出版和版税之类的事情
I had studied all of his business deals.
因为我研究了他所有的生意
You know- our first week of classes,
你知道 我们第一周上课的时候
we had this program, um, meeting that we would do
我们有个小组项目 需要我们
which, um, they were weekly assemblies
一起开个项目会议
where everybody in our major would get together and
我们专业的所有人每周都要聚在一起
discuss things that were happening in the industry,
讨论这个行业正在发生的事情
um, we would have speakers come in from, you know,
我们会有来自各个唱片公♥司♥
various record labels or NARAS, which, you know,
或来自和格莱美合作的
works with the Grammys and- and different songwriters, things like that.
美国国家录音艺术与科学学会的演讲嘉宾
It was a time to come together and
还有不同的词曲作者
really assess the landscape of the music business and
诸如此类的人们齐聚一堂 来真正评估音乐行业的前景
the very first program meeting,
第一次项目会议
I was introducing myself to the group, as a whole.
我向整个小组成员介绍我自己
and I don't remember if I was running for some sort of like-
我有点记不清我当时是不是
representative position or if I just wanted to
为了竞选某个代表职务
introduce myself for whatever reason?
或者我仅仅只是想介绍自己 不知道因为什么
But, I was wearing a Jackson's Victory Tour T-Shirt, and it was vintage.
我那天穿了一件 杰克逊"胜利"巡演的老式T恤
I had just bought it in the village, and a young man came up to me
那是我刚在纽约买♥♥的 然后一个年轻人走向我
and told me that he liked my shirt and, ah…
他告诉我他喜欢我的T恤
That young man turned out to be Jordan Chandler.
那个年轻人就是乔迪·钱德勒
I have on the phone with me investigative journalist, Charles Thomson,
我现在要和一个调查记者查尔斯·汤姆森通话
who is the winner of 6 national awards for his recent, um,
他是6项国家新闻大奖的获得者
investigative work exposing the Shoebury pedophile ring.
因为他最近的调查工作 曝光了休伯里恋童癖团伙
So Charles, you've sat in on a lot of pedophile cases.
查尔斯你参与调查了很多恋童癖案件
What would you say are the main differences
你认为这些案件和迈克尔杰克逊案件的
between the cases that you've sat in on and the Michael Jackson case?
主要不同之处在哪里
Of course, the first difference
当然第一个不同之处是
is that the cases that I've covered were all criminal cases
我参与报道的都是刑事案件
where there was was no real financial incentive to make an allegation,
提出指控都没有真正的经济动机
so the motive of seeking millions of dollars is removed.
所以谋取数百万美元的经济目的是不存在的
And then in the cases where we see convictions that I’ve been sitting in,
再说在我所经历的定罪案件中
you had victims who were credible, who were consistent,
受害者是可信的 他们言行一致
and that's never been the case in the allegations against Michael Jackson.
而在针对迈克尔·杰克逊的案子中 控告者却完全不是这样
They've never been consistent.
那些指控者言行从来就不一致
They've always turned out to be perjurers
他们总是被证明是伪证者
and people who were just looking for a payout.
他们只是为了索要巨款
Michael Jackson was one of the most famous people on the planet.
迈克尔·杰克逊是地球上最著名的人之一
It turns out he was also the target of intensive FBI scrutiny.
也是美国联邦调查局FBI严密调查的对象
I have also read that you have
查尔斯 我还知道你
extensively studied the Michael Jackson FBI files.
细致地研究了关于迈克尔·杰克逊的FBI调查文件
What were the findings of the FBI files and
那这个FBI调查文件里有什么调查结果
were child porn was ever discovered at Neverland?
在梦幻庄园有没有发现儿童色情读物？
No child porn was ever found at Neverland.
在梦幻庄园从来没有找到过儿童色情读物
And in fact, there was a story that said
事实上 说梦幻庄园有儿童色情读物
child porn had been found around the time of the trial
这是审判期间传出的故事
So the judge and the prosecutor both released
因此法官和检察官都公开
a stipulation publicly which was that:
发布了一项约定性条款
No child pornography was ever found at Neverland
说明在迈克尔·杰克逊的梦幻庄园
or at any of Michael Jackson's properties.
根本没找到所谓的儿童色情读物
So that's not just something that the fans say.
所以这不仅仅是粉丝们说的话
That's the judge in the trial and even the prosecutor
甚至法官和检察官也都说了
said that there was no child porn.
根本没有所谓的儿童色情物品
In terms of what the FBI files tell us, ah, what they tell us
根据联邦调查局的文件中可以找到
is that for over a decade, the FBI was intermittently
在长达十多年的时间里 联邦调查局断断续续地
involved in investigating Michael Jackson.
对迈克尔杰克逊进行了调查
There's no evidence of sustained surveillance or
没有证据显示联邦调查局
sustained investigation, only of the authorities
进行了持续监视或持续调查
occasionally calling the FBI to assist them
只是当局有时 会请联邦调查局 协助他们进行调查
with their own investigations, but nonetheless, the files tell us
但尽管如此 这些文件告诉我们
That more than 20 different FBI departments
有超过20个不同的联邦调查局部门
investigated Michael Jackson at one time or another,
曾经调查过迈克尔·杰克逊
and none of them found any evidence of any wrongdoing.
没有任何人发现 他有任何不当行为的证据
Perhaps the most compelling piece of information
或许从这些文件中
that came out of those files was that
得到的最有说服力的信息
when the prosecutors in the 2003 - '05 Arvizo case
就是2003年至2005年阿维佐案的检察官
sent away all of the computers that they seized at Neverland
查封了梦幻庄园所有的电脑
to the FBI for analysis, the FBI was unable to find
送到联邦调查局进行分♥析♥ 而任何一台电脑上
anything incriminating on a single one of them.
都没有找到能证明迈克尔·杰克逊有罪的任何信息
So the FBI files don't exonerate Michael Jackson,
当然仅凭联邦调查局的文件
but they certainly don't incriminate him.
并不能证明迈克尔杰克逊无罪
In 2005, there was a study done by ABC
在2005年 美国广播公♥司♥
with the top psychiatrists in the country and they all concluded that
与全国顶尖的精神病学家进行了一项研究
Michael Jackson’s behavior would be very rare amongst pedophiles.
他们都认为真正的恋童者 难以有迈克尔·杰克逊的这样的行为
And there are other psychologists and psychiatrists who echo that belief.
其他心理学家和精神病学家也持同样的观点
His father said in an interview two years ago
他的父亲两年前在一个采访里说
that had he not beaten his son
如果他没有打他的儿子…
the latter wouldn't have end up as the Number 1 in pop business.
他的儿子就不会最终成为流行音乐业里的头号♥明星
He was afraid of his father and at the same time
他害怕他的父亲 但同时
he always craved for the love of his father...
他又总是渴求他父亲的爱…
And the father has mocked his face,his acne and his nose.
他的父亲 嘲弄他的脸 他的痤疮 他的鼻子
And he wanted to please the father,
他想要取悦他的父亲
I would say paradoxically because he was afraid of him.
我想说这种自相矛盾 是因为他怕他
But he didn't get the love from the father
但他没有从父亲那里得到他渴望的爱
he craved for and this love was left behind all his life.
而这种爱在他整个人生中都缺席了
And what he is doing now is that he gathers children around him
他现在做的就是把孩子们聚集在身边
and wants to have children around in order to be a father to them.
想要成为他们的父亲
So he is child and father in one single person.
所以他在自己身体里既是孩子又是父亲
And what he does with children,he actually does it with himself...
他和孩子们一起做的事其实就是他对自己做的事
in the genuine,completely innocent
这个天真的人 是以真诚 完全纯真
and completely good-hearted way from a naive person.
和完全好心的方式在行事
Martin Bashir has tricked him,he has taken advantage of him.
马丁·巴舍尔耍了他 利用了他
Someone who is always trying to dispute that notion
有一个叫吉姆·克莱门特的人
is a man named Jim Clemente.
总是试图质疑这一观点
Jim Clemente, to this day, believes that Michael Jackson
直到今天 吉姆·克莱门特仍然认为迈克尔·杰克逊
does fit the profile of a pedophile
符合恋童者的特征
And that Michael Jackson did have child porn at Neverland.
他认为迈克尔·杰克逊的梦幻庄园里真的有儿童色情读物
They found, um, images
他们找到了些 图片...
and I think they were of a photoshoot with
其实那些照片是
Michael Jackson's nephew, Taj.
迈克尔·杰克逊和他的侄子塔吉·杰克逊的照片
I think he was still a teenager.
我想他那时还是个青少年
And there's a picture that's on the internet that I
还有这是一张网上的照片
Um, It's a picture of Michael. You see that?
是迈克尔的一张照片你看到了吗？
WHAT?! OH MY…. Yes, yes.
什么 噢 是的 我看到了
So there are pictures in this series where’s he actually
所以这些照片是一个系列的 在这些照片里
their cloth and trying to RIP it off him,
他实际上 要扯那块布 还尝试从他身上撕下来
laughing, and joking, and trying to get him naked.
他还笑着 开玩笑 想让他赤♥裸♥着
And he's I mean, he's virtually naked in this picture
我是说在这张照片中 他几乎是全♥裸♥的
This is his NEPHEW...
这是他的侄子
This FORTY something year old man...
这个40多岁的男人啊
And why is he posing in a picture where Michael's
为什么他在一张照片中摆姿势
shirt is open, exposing his chest and
迈克尔的T恤衫敬开着 露出了他的胸口
this kid's chest- I mean-
还有这个孩子的胸